Where is transgender in the Bible?

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Expand view Topic review: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by jimwalton » Sat Nov 19, 2022 2:59 am

​> What’s female clothes today, first off men wore skirts in the 18 hundreds, and that was considered masculine, it’s completely subjective.

You're correct about this, of course. We do know from ancient writings that transvestism was prohibited in the ancient Near East. Keil & Delitzsch write that the design of the prohibition in Dt. 22.5 is "to maintain the sanctity of the distinction of the sexes." Walton, Matthews, and Chavalas write that clothing served to distinguish gender and that the point of the text is to show that God wants to maintain gender distinction. Though the meaning of clothing is ascribed culturally, "the blurring of boundaries violates order." Rabbi Shalman said, "The text speaks of trying to pass for the other sex, not of cultural fashion statements."

> And I do listen and follow the Bible.

I'm glad, because it's the Bible that we're talking about.

> And even if it was a sin, we all sin and my sins r no worse then your sins, they r all forgivable

Yes we do, and yes they are, but those who belong to Christ do everything possible (or are supposed to do everything possible) to eschew sin.

> people act like being trans is literally the unforgivable sin…come on !!!

I don't act this way, though I know some do. We know some sins are worse than others, but we aren't given the list of hierarchy.

>He will forgive murderers and child rapists, yet oh no that trans person there doomed no matter what. It’s crazy to think that way,

Just for the record, I don't think that way.

>As long as u r a true believer in Christ and try to follow the Bible the best u can, that’s what matters.

This is true.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by Baza » Mon May 31, 2021 4:54 pm

what’s female clothes today, first off men wore skirts in the 18 hundreds, and that was considered masculine, it’s completely subjective. And I do listen and follow the Bible. And even if it was a sin, we all sin and my sins r no worse then your sins, they r all forgivable, people act like being trans is literally the unforgivable sin…come on !!! He will forgive murderers and child rapists, yet oh no that trans person there doomed no matter what. It’s crazy to think that way, God will forgive anybody. As long as u r a true believer in Christ and try to follow the Bible the best u can, that’s what matters.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by jimwalton » Mon May 31, 2021 4:48 pm

Paul is talking about how people get to Heaven, not about anyone's status IN Heaven. He is not saying there aren't these things in heaven, though that may or may not be true. What he is talking about is what restrictions and conditions there are to being a child of God (law or faith, grace or works) The point is that in Jesus Christ there are no race or national distinctions, and sex rivalry and class differences disappear.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by Baza » Mon May 31, 2021 4:43 pm

How is that saying there will be salvation to us all that verse is not saying that, it’s saying god doesn’t have slave or free people or poor or rich, and Jews won’t be special and better then gentile and he will not see gender any longer. That’s obvious. U can argue till the cows come home but that completely obvious.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by jimwalton » Mon May 31, 2021 4:39 pm

Thank you for clarifying that. Somebody should get the "T" out of LGBTQ, then, but I know these things have a life of their own.

And just for the record, I wasn't claiming that trans are gay. But thank you for clarifying that as well.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by Baza » Mon May 31, 2021 4:38 pm

and trans people don’t put themselves in that category that was a few people who came up with that it has nothing to do with actually trans people unless they say they r a part of it. So most trans aren’t gay that’s a fact.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by jimwalton » Mon May 31, 2021 4:35 pm

Thanks for the conversation. The text in Galatians 3 is all about who is in Christ and who is not based on whether the old covenant is still in effect or whether it has been fulfilled by Christ and superseded by the new covenant (3,.19). He is talking about who gets to inherit salvation (3.18). it does not come by the law (3.21) but rather by grace through faith (3.22-24). He says in v. 26 that everyone in Christ Jesus is a child of God, and that is his point. Whether slave or free, male or female, Jew or Gentile, if you are in Christ you are a child of God. He is not even getting close to making a statement about gender acceptance.

And who says we won't have gender in heaven? The angels don't have gender; that's all we know about that one. There is no biblical text that says or hints that we will have no gender in heaven. If you know of one, I'd be glad to discuss it with you.

In Gal. 3.28, Paul is saying that the common points of discrimination and hostility in their culture (slave or free, Jew or Gentile, male or female) have no pertinence to salvation. When it comes to salvation, there are no categories of advantage or disadvantage. It is open to al equally and on the same basis. That's Paul's point.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by Baza » Mon May 31, 2021 4:33 pm

no he’s saying gender does not matter to him in heaven especially we probably won’t even have a gender in heaven. U didn’t really answer anything, except prove it’s not in the Bible. That’s not true at all, no slave nor free Jew nor gentile male or female is exactly what it says, it’s not saying what u r trying to make it say. Those things will not exist.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by jimwalton » Mon May 31, 2021 9:14 am

It is not my place to judge. It is my place to teach the Bible as honestly and accurately as possible. Where the Bible doesn't take a stand, I don't take a stand; where the Bible does take a stand, I stand with the Bible. But I don't judge people.

What I'm saying is that you must study the Bible as open-mindedly and as thoroughly as possible, and if you are dedicated to follow what the Bible says, then you follow it.

The Bible doesn't say anything about transgenderism because such a choice did not exist in the ancient world. They did have expressions of transvestism, and the Bible says God does not approve. It doesn't explain why, but there are other verses in the Bible where the text warns against gender confusion and teaches to maintain sexual distinctions. In biblical days, gender confusion was considered to be a destabilizing element in society. It was also perceived as a rejection of God's created order.

We can talk about these things more.

Re: Where is transgender in the Bible?

Post by Baza » Mon May 31, 2021 9:14 am

I already messaged u. And I’m trans, and I’m a Christian, so r u saying I can’t be a Christian because I’m trans?

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