by jimwalton » Sat Nov 19, 2022 9:27 am
> But none of these verses say that the Holy Spirit is the 3rd person of a trinity. None of these verses even mention a trinity.
The word "trinity" doesn't appear anywhere in the Bible. It's a clear biblical theology, not a biblical term. The Bible doesn't use the word trinity, but it teaches the trinity. I listed verses for you where the Bible shows (1) The Holy Spirit is a person, not a force, (2) The Holy Spirit is considered to be equal to the Father and the Son, (3) The Holy Spirit is considered to be deity. That's what the doctrine of the trinity teaches.
> If all 3 members of the trinity are the Almighty God, and are co-equal, how could you pray to one of them but exclude another one?
Each member of the Godhead has its specific roles. The Father and the Spirit didn't die on the cross; that doesn't mean they're not God or co-equal. The Spirit lives inside of us, not the Father. That doesn't mean the Father isn't God or co-equal. While they are of one essence, they are 3 Persons of different function.
> Yes or no, is it idolatry to pray to the Holy Spirit?
No, I wouldn't call it idolatry. I'm just saying that the Bible says we should pray to the Father. Hearing prayers is His role. but it's not like you're a horrible sinner or committing idolatry to pray to the Spirit. Most likely people who pray to the Spirit just don't understand or have never learned what the Bible teaches about it.
> the Bible says we receive the Holy Spirit as part of the new birth correct?
Yes.
> Is it your belief that we receive only 1 of the 3 members of the trinity?
It is the Holy Spirit's role to be the indwelling one. But Jesus says in John 14 that when the Holy Spirit is in us, Jesus is in us also—in Spirit. Gal. 2.20 says Christ lives in me. It is via the Spirit that Jesus indwells us.
We receive Christ (Jn. 1.12). The Holy Spirit indwells. They each have their role and function.
In the Bible, the Trinity distinguishes between the principle of divine action and the subject of divine action. The principle of all divine action is the one undivided divine essence, but the subject of divine action is either Father, Son, or Holy Spirit. The Father can send the Son according to his power, and the Son can be incarnated according to his nature without dividing the divine essence.
> When we are “Spirit filled”, do we have all 3 of the members of the trinity living inside of us? Or only 1? or only 2?
The Spirit is God who indwells, but the Bible says Jesus is in us (Jn. 17.26; Gal. 2.20). The Bible never uses the terminology that the Father lives in us. That's not His role.
> can you pray to one trinity member and exclude the other 2?
The Bible instructs us to pray to the Father. But we pray in the name of Jesus, and the Spirit helps us pray.
> But none of these verses say that the Holy Spirit is the 3rd person of a trinity. None of these verses even mention a trinity.
The word "trinity" doesn't appear anywhere in the Bible. It's a clear biblical theology, not a biblical term. The Bible doesn't use the word trinity, but it teaches the trinity. I listed verses for you where the Bible shows (1) The Holy Spirit is a person, not a force, (2) The Holy Spirit is considered to be equal to the Father and the Son, (3) The Holy Spirit is considered to be deity. That's what the doctrine of the trinity teaches.
> If all 3 members of the trinity are the Almighty God, and are co-equal, how could you pray to one of them but exclude another one?
Each member of the Godhead has its specific roles. The Father and the Spirit didn't die on the cross; that doesn't mean they're not God or co-equal. The Spirit lives inside of us, not the Father. That doesn't mean the Father isn't God or co-equal. While they are of one essence, they are 3 Persons of different function.
> Yes or no, is it idolatry to pray to the Holy Spirit?
No, I wouldn't call it idolatry. I'm just saying that the Bible says we should pray to the Father. Hearing prayers is His role. but it's not like you're a horrible sinner or committing idolatry to pray to the Spirit. Most likely people who pray to the Spirit just don't understand or have never learned what the Bible teaches about it.
> the Bible says we receive the Holy Spirit as part of the new birth correct?
Yes.
> Is it your belief that we receive only 1 of the 3 members of the trinity?
It is the Holy Spirit's role to be the indwelling one. But Jesus says in John 14 that when the Holy Spirit is in us, Jesus is in us also—in Spirit. Gal. 2.20 says Christ lives in me. It is via the Spirit that Jesus indwells us.
We receive Christ (Jn. 1.12). The Holy Spirit indwells. They each have their role and function.
In the Bible, the Trinity distinguishes between the principle of divine action and the subject of divine action. The principle of all divine action is the one undivided divine essence, but the subject of divine action is either Father, Son, or Holy Spirit. The Father can send the Son according to his power, and the Son can be incarnated according to his nature without dividing the divine essence.
> When we are “Spirit filled”, do we have all 3 of the members of the trinity living inside of us? Or only 1? or only 2?
The Spirit is God who indwells, but the Bible says Jesus is in us (Jn. 17.26; Gal. 2.20). The Bible never uses the terminology that the Father lives in us. That's not His role.
> can you pray to one trinity member and exclude the other 2?
The Bible instructs us to pray to the Father. But we pray in the name of Jesus, and the Spirit helps us pray.