by jimwalton » Thu Dec 15, 2022 3:14 pm
> God created reality, yes?
No. Reality existed in the Godhead before creation. Since God is, there was always personality, morality, logic, reason, intellect, cause-and-effect, love, and many other things. What God created is the natural world.
> including hell, and the rules by which a person goes to hell. Yes?
Yes and no. Yes, God created Hell, but it was for the devil and His angels, not for people (Matthew 25.41). No, God didn't create the rules by which a person goes to Hell. Reality is what it is. Hell is de facto the state of life without God, not so much a place and no so much bound by rules. It's a state of being where one is separated from God. There is no other choice (it's not like God had to make it this way) that if one is separated from God, then one's state of being is separation from God. It's the nature of reality.
> I've concluded that its not true. So now, if it turns out it is true, I'm screwed.
Correct. Every decision has consequences. When we make the decisions we do, the consequences follow.
> I didn't do anything wrong here
According to the Bible, you did do something wrong. You decided for the lie instead of the truth. It's the same with many things in our culture. Just watch the news and see how people respond. Some people choose to decide for what is a lie instead of the truth.
> My eternal soul is at stake here. God should reveal himself.
The Bible is God's revelation of Himself through history in space and time. Thankfully we have a written record of it—1600 pages worth. God is also revealing Himself every day, even through conversations like this. You have a choice to decide for lies or the truth.
> I would need to know that the Bible is correct in order to weigh the options it presents.
This is a discussion we can have.
> If I don't know that hell, god, sin, Jesus, if I don't know that all that stuff really happened and is real, then I'm not going to evaluate actions based on the real consequences that are implied by these things.
We are each burdened with having to weigh the evidences and make choices, and those choices have consequences, especially in a case like this (eternal destiny and fate). If you are not convinced that Hell, God, sin, or Jesus, etc. really happened and are real, you are free to make your choices and live with the consequences of those decisions, just like everything else in real life.
> If Christianity is true, god's hiddenness is preventing me from making informed decisions.
God has revealed enough of Himself for you to make a very informed decision. We have 1600 pages of records, so far 4000 years of God interacting in people's lives in history, and 2.5 billion Christians on the planet that can help reveal God to you. The obstacle is not a lack of revelation but what you choose to do with it.
> God created reality, yes?
No. Reality existed in the Godhead before creation. Since God is, there was always personality, morality, logic, reason, intellect, cause-and-effect, love, and many other things. What God created is the natural world.
> including hell, and the rules by which a person goes to hell. Yes?
Yes and no. Yes, God created Hell, but it was for the devil and His angels, not for people (Matthew 25.41). No, God didn't create the rules by which a person goes to Hell. Reality is what it is. Hell is de facto the state of life without God, not so much a place and no so much bound by rules. It's a state of being where one is separated from God. There is no other choice (it's not like God had to make it this way) that if one is separated from God, then one's state of being is separation from God. It's the nature of reality.
> I've concluded that its not true. So now, if it turns out it is true, I'm screwed.
Correct. Every decision has consequences. When we make the decisions we do, the consequences follow.
> I didn't do anything wrong here
According to the Bible, you did do something wrong. You decided for the lie instead of the truth. It's the same with many things in our culture. Just watch the news and see how people respond. Some people choose to decide for what is a lie instead of the truth.
> My eternal soul is at stake here. God should reveal himself.
The Bible is God's revelation of Himself through history in space and time. Thankfully we have a written record of it—1600 pages worth. God is also revealing Himself every day, even through conversations like this. You have a choice to decide for lies or the truth.
> I would need to know that the Bible is correct in order to weigh the options it presents.
This is a discussion we can have.
> If I don't know that hell, god, sin, Jesus, if I don't know that all that stuff really happened and is real, then I'm not going to evaluate actions based on the real consequences that are implied by these things.
We are each burdened with having to weigh the evidences and make choices, and those choices have consequences, especially in a case like this (eternal destiny and fate). If you are not convinced that Hell, God, sin, or Jesus, etc. really happened and are real, you are free to make your choices and live with the consequences of those decisions, just like everything else in real life.
> If Christianity is true, god's hiddenness is preventing me from making informed decisions.
God has revealed enough of Himself for you to make a very informed decision. We have 1600 pages of records, so far 4000 years of God interacting in people's lives in history, and 2.5 billion Christians on the planet that can help reveal God to you. The obstacle is not a lack of revelation but what you choose to do with it.