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[Felix the Cat]

You claim there is misogyny in the bible? How about we start with this: http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/women/long.html

[jimwalton]

Oh no. Not another cheap link to the "Skeptics Annotated Bible." First of all, how can I meaningfully deal with 388 passages? The SAB is superficial, ludicrous, and, may I say it, asinine. Let's take the first few:

1. "God fashions a woman out of one of Adam's ribs. This was necessary since Adam couldn't find a "help meet" in any of the animals that God made for him. 2:20-22." This shows a grotesque misunderstanding of the text and the event. An honest study of the text shows that both the "help meet" concept and the "rib" event are specifically (linguistically and contextually) showing how woman is every much his equal—equal in status and in worth, equal in role and function, and equal in godlikeness. Any other reading of the text is distorted and deliberately misrepresenting the text.

2. "Adam blames Eve and Eve blames the serpent. 3:12-13." How is this demeaning to women? It's not. Adam was completely at fault in taking the fruit, because he was THERE THE WHOLE TIME. He was no deceived, but acted purposefully. Eve, on the other hand, was deceived by the serpent. She comes out of the story looking better than he does, and later in the NT we find that he is the one blamed for the sin, not her.

3. " 'In sorrow thou shalt bring forth children. ... Thy husband ... shall rule over thee.' God punishes Eve, and all women after her, with the pains of childbirth and subjection to men. 3:16." God punished both Adam and Eve with pains and suffering. He didn't curse her with subjection to men, but stated that as a result of their sin, their relationship would now be a power struggle, not the beauty of equality, as it had been designed.

4. "Adam is also punished, although less severely. He now will have to work for a living because he 'hearkened unto the voice" of his wife.' 3:17." Adam's curse points directly back to the blessing and mandate of God to "rule and subdue." His curse is not that he will have to work for a living (which is just a laughable interpretation), but that his sin has caused a change in the cosmos itself.

I'm not going to do this for all 388, but somebody should at least be honest with you and tell you that this "Skeptics Annotated Bible" is a risible document, apparently assembled by people who don't have a clue. If you want to have an honest discussion with me, let's do it. If you're going to throw this cheap detritus at me, we really can't talk about misogyny, or any other topic.

Let's talk honestly about the alleged misogyny in the Bible. In Gn. 1.26-27, God created all humanity (both man and woman) in his image. Both of them are in his image, equally. Both of them are mandated to rule. Both are blessed in 1.28 to fill the earth and subdue it. Both are mandated to rule, as equal co-regents of God. That's the design of creation.

In Gn. 2.18 (20), where God says, "I will make a helper suitable for him," the word that is used for "helper" is one that is often used of God through the OT, as one who helps Israel. Assuredly we are not to interpret this word as "inferior assistant." It is a position of partnership. The intent is that she will be a power (or strength) equal to him. She is, in a real sense, a savior.

When the man is put into a "deep sleep" in Gn. 2.21, that is the word for a spiritual trance. What he is shown is a vision: "half" of him is her, and she is "bone of his bone and flesh of his flesh": his equal partner, made from the same stuff he is made, not subordinate but "one flesh" with him.

When they sin in chapter 3, they sin together. The man and woman are both present; they both disobey, they both get judged. She is judged in relation to God's blessing (be fruitful); he is judged in relation to God's mandate (rule and subdue). Their relationship with each other, because of the entrance of sin, is altered, as a consequence of what they have done, from equality to power. Now they function as selves instead of as "one".

If you want to talk about misogyny, let's talk. Leave the stupidity of the SAB out of it, please.