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[Boom Izzy]

If anyone could have an audible conversation with God whenever they wanted to, do you think the world would be a better place? Would more people go to heaven?

I understand that Christian's talk to God when they pray and that some also some claim that God talks back to them through signs or even visions. When other people ask why they cannot communicate with God, the answer is normally their faith needs to be stronger or that they need to strengthen their relationship with God.

My question is, if anyone at anytime could talk to God, and he would audibly talk back just like normal conversation, do you think the world would be better place and do you think more people would go to heaven. If yes, why do you think God chose the way things are now, where not anyone can talk to him?

[jimwalton]

The Bible shows us that audible conversations with God don't make people believers or make the world a better place. Adam & Eve had audible conversations with God, and they disobeyed Him. God had an audible conversation with Cain—that didn't help. God spoke to various kings in Genesis, but that didn't make the world a better place. Everyone who knew Jesus was having an audible conversation with God, and they crucified Him.

It turns out that God making himself obvious (by audible conversations and by miraculous events) doesn't have a ton of effect on people. What we learn from the Bible, and from life experiences, is that being convinced in the mind and the heart are what matter, not hearing voices and seeing miracles.

[Boom Izzy]

I thought the stories in the old testament (edit: Genesis) weren't literal? Either way, people are much more educated than they were 2000 years ago, don't you think that would make a difference?

Take me for example, I am not christian because I am not convinced of Gods existence, but if I could talk to him, I would know he exists.

[jimwalton]

> I thought the stories in the old testament (edit: Genesis) weren't literal?

I believe they're historical. "Literal" is not a helpful word. For instance, Genesis 1-2 are not about the material manufacture of the cosmos, but instead about how God ordered the cosmos to function (light and darkness function in periods to give us night and day, and their alternating sequence give us the function we call TIME). The earth functions to bring forth vegetation. The heavenly bodies function to give us seasons. Humans function to rule the Earth and subdue it. That really happened.

Adam and Eve function to rule the Earth and subdue it, to multiple and fill the Earth, and to fill the role of God's priests on Earth. That really happened.

The flood really happened, but it wasn't global.

The Tower of Babel was a historical event that happened sometime from 2500-2000ish BC.

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are historical figures.

We can talk about these more if you want.

> Either way, people are much more educated than they were 2000 years ago, don't you think that would make a difference?

Education doesn't make a difference. The people then might not have been literate, but they weren't stupid. We still don't know how they made Stonehenge, the pyramids, and other things. They figured out how to smelt metals, how to make ice in the desert. The Romans figured out how to pour cement under water. Herod's architectural engineers were absolute geniuses. Just because people were pre-literate, we're not to think they were stupid. In ways, I think education has made people dumber (in ways). People don't know how to fix their own stuff any more. They don't know anything about electricity, plumbing, their cars, appliances—nothing. They know what's in their books and in their disciplines of study, but they're not very wise in the world, so to speak.

I think people from all eras would be freaked if God spoke to them, as we see the people in the Bible were. I don't think education has anything to do with it. Except, of course, that I have talked to some people on this forum who said that even if God spoke to them, and even if they knew it was God and not a hallucination, and even if God proved Himself to them in undeniable ways, they still wouldn't believe it. In some cases someone's educational skepticism can get in the way of seeing the truth.

> Take me for example, I am not christian because I am not convinced of Gods existence, but if I could talk to him, I would know he exists.

I've asked this question on this forum before, and I'm not so convinced of your answer. I've posed this to someone: "Suppose you were in your room alone, and God appeared to you. I mean, REALLY appeared to you. And suppose you could tell is was good, and that this was real and not a dream, psychotic event, or hallucination. And suppose you asked him to prove it by whatever means you designed and God did that to prove it to you. What would you think?" And they answered, "I wouldn't believe it. I would still think my mind was playing tricks on me."

So much for the idea that "if I could talk to God, I would know he exists."

[Boom Izzy]

I don't know how I would know that it was God. If I was alone I would probably be pretty skeptical unless I was able to capture whatever it was I was seeing on video. Otherwise yeah I would probably think it was a hallucination. If I captured God on video or there were other people there who experienced the same thing then I would know it was real.

If God answered and spoke to me whenever I wanted to talk to him I would also believe he is real. The reality however (at least for me) was that I was a Christian for over 20 years and no matter what I did I never heard or saw anything from God.

[jimwalton]

> I don't know how I would know that it was God

Part of my setup was that God revealed Himself to you as God: bright light, self-identification, able to do miracles, knew everything about you—you know, you could tell it was God.

> If I was alone I would probably be pretty skeptical unless I was able to capture whatever it was I was seeing on video. Otherwise yeah I would probably think it was a hallucination.

But this seems funny to me, because you said that if God talked to you, you might believe He existed. But now you're saying that if He talked to you, you'd probably think it was a hallucination. Which is it?

> If I captured God on video or there were other people there who experienced the same thing then I would know it was real.

Even if there were others there, I wonder if you'd accept it. I have a tendency to think you'd all figure out a way to rationalize it away. I still think it depends more on what your heart and mind are life rather than on whether He talks to you or not.

> If God answered and spoke to me whenever I wanted to talk to him I would also believe he is real.

In the Bible, we find that some did and some didn't. I get what you're saying, and you think, "Well, that would be pretty obvious, wouldn't it?" At the same time, though, here's what I wonder. Even if people knew God existed, the way you're talking, it's still a different matter of people (1) loving Him, and (2) doing what He tells you to do. And I still wonder if people would just attribute it to "voices in my head." Y'know what I mean?

> The reality however (at least for me) was that I was a Christian for over 20 years and no matter what I did I never heard or saw anything from God.

I also don't have that kind of relationship with God. He doesn't generally do things for me, except for a few notable occasions. In a very difficult period of my life where I was deep in a dark emotional hole for several years, I begged for something more tangible, more obvious from God. It never came, and it made me even more angry and depressed. As I continued to read, think, pray, scream, and meditate, I came to realize that God "talking to me" or evidencing Himself according to my desires was a very self-centered approach to a relationship with God. I wanted God to conform to my needs, my desires, and my demands. I wanted to be able to see Him in my life. But that's backwards.

I realize now that I believe in God because it's true, not because of what He does or does not do for me. Even if I got nothing (which is never true), I should believe in God if He is really there. I should digest how He has revealed Himself, so that I see Him as He is, not as I think He should be. I should learn to hear His voice in the Bible (which is what the Bible is) rather than wanting Him to talk to me according to my plans, conversations, and moods. So I came to a place in life where I realize God doesn't owe me the kind of relationship I desire or think is best. Instead, I owe God my life, and "come what may." When I give my life to God, I mean it. It's his to do with as suits Him. If He wants to talk to me, I would love that. But for some, "There were others who were tortured, refusing to be released so that they might gain an even better resurrection. Some faced jeers and flogging, and even chains and imprisonment. They were put to death by stoning; they were sawed in two; they were killed by the sword. They went about in sheepskins and goatskins, destitute, persecuted and mistreated. ... They wandered in deserts and mountains, living in caves and in holes in the ground" (Hebrews 11.35-38). If I'm serious when I give my life to God, then I can't retain control over it and dictate how the relationship should go. He's the Father, I'm the child.