Board index ‹ Jesus

[Rick Flair]

Why is Jesus not engulfed in flames? Christians are claiming the penalty for sin is to be engulfed in flames forever and that Jesus paid that penalty so why is he not in Hell?

The penalty for sin is an eternity engulfed in flames in Hell they say but they also say Jesus paid that penalty so people that accept Him can go to Heaven.

Jesus isn't on fire in Hell right now so how did he pay the penalty?

[jimwalton]

He broke the power of sin and death so that Hell doesn't have any hold on Him.

[Rick Flair]

If the penalty is X I want Jesus to pay X. I want him in Hell. Now.

[jimwalton]

You're welcome to your opinion, but for myself, I want someone stronger than that. If Hell is strong enough to hold God, then He's not God. The Bible gives us evidence that Jesus is stronger than Hell—that Hell could not hold Him Jesus paid for sins. Jesus succumbed to death. Jesus (possibly) went to Hell. But then He broke free. He is stronger than all of it. For that I'm more than glad. Penalty paid, strength broken. I am no longer a slave to fear; I have no reason to fear Hell. Jesus has broken its power.

[Rick Flair]

I want him to burn if that is the penalty

[jimwalton]

It sounds like your hatred towards Jesus is skewing your thoughts about what Jesus did to secure freedom from sin for anyone who comes to Him. You seem to want a weak, defeated god. I'm glad to have one who can actually accomplish what He set out to achieve.

[Graham]

(for the weekend) and then he dipped.

[jimwalton]

It's all it takes to show He was not enslaved by it or captured by it. He went of His own free will; He broke out when He chose. It was not a contest of strength, but more like shooting fish in a bucket. Jesus showed supreme power. Hey, if they locked you in shackles and chains, and you could break out within five minutes, it doesn't work to say, "Well, that doesn't count. You did it too fast." 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day, 1 week—whatever. If you can break it at will, that's the point.

[Graham]

He didn’t go on his own freewill, in fact he begged god to not die in the garden, he was sweating blood about it. What would have happened if Jesus disobeyed god? His purpose was gods singular idea, he never actually had any say. Wasn’t Jesus’ entire purpose to die on earth?

[jimwalton]

> He didn’t go on his own freewill

This is contrary to Jesus's own words in John 10.17-18: "The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

> in fact he begged god to not die in the garden

Correct. Crucifixion is a horrific way to die. But in John 12.27 Jesus knows that He came to Earth for this very purpose.

> What would have happened if Jesus disobeyed god?

This is an unanswerable question, but I would claim it was impossible for Jesus to disobey God.

> His purpose was gods singular idea,

This is not exactly correct. God the Father and God the Son shared the purpose that Jesus would die for the sins of the world (Mark 10.45; 1 Peter 1.20).

> he never actually had any say

This is patently incorrect, as I have shown from Jesus's own words in John 10.17-18.

> Wasn’t Jesus’ entire purpose to die on earth?

It was a primary purpose, yes, but not His only purpose. He also came to serve humanity (Mk. 10.45) , He came to form His church (Mt. 16.18), He came to bring people to repentance (Mt. 3.2 et al), and He came to establish His kingdom.